Watching cis men come up with a special word for the oppression trans men face from trans women: I don’t even
If you saw my response to fuckboytempo, yeah. I had to google around to find out and when I did it was like, “are y’all for real.”
I don’t know who came up with the term, though. But it’s intriguing to me to see cis men leap on the bandwagon of accusing trans women of oppressing trans men for having vaginas. And another discussion in which cis women were talking about it that I still don’t understand.
I just saw that other post you linked, and “funny how it keeps being about keeping pussyhavers in their place but i’m sure it’s all just a coincidence” fuck please just never talk about the trans community again because you have everything exactly the wrong way round
These fucking people.
Especially Luka. Spin-doctoring quotes for an audience so as to make teenagers on the internet, trans women who don’t buy into his shit and generally just sort of baiting people for responses and then using any excuse to launch into full blown abusive behavior.
(For this he is a minor internet celebrity in his small corner of the tumblr-verse. And scary popular in the queer/trans wing of the Homestuck fandom.)
Seebs is real precious too — also a spin doctor, also playing for an audience, the very stereotype of That Guy On The Internet Who Thinks Emotion Makes You Irrational And The Person Who Argues Best Is Correct…
Roachpatrol with the whole squicky fetishizing of trans women even as she launches into transmisogyny and, much like the others, heaps abuse on trans women who speak up, even politely and patiently in the name of good-faith attempts to communicate.
I don’t know if Ozymandias-whatever-string-of-digits-it-is-this-week is connected with them, but being as ze’s connected to most of my erstwhile friends who think the others mentioned above are basically cool (and often have no idea what they’ve done) I always wonder when that name’s gonna come up on my dash again. And ze’s every bit as blatant as roachpatrol, and has abused friends of mine…
And they’re all only a degree or two seperated from yet another cluster of differently-but-still-genuinely harmful apologists for this stuff.
(And yet I wonder why I fall back on vagueblogging and blacklists so much…)
EDIT: Oh yeah, Jumpingjacktrash, too…
That pretty much covers the people I saw talking about ~isomisogyny~.
I had an argument with these people over my being too transmisandrist in my response to Seebs saying that straight partners of queer people should be allowed into queer spaces. (He’s a run-of-the-mill homophobe, yes.)
They literally ganged up to say I was schizophrenic.
For days Seebs was dissecting my posts in front of an audience on his blog, pretending to find contradictions in my pointing his contradictions, calling me insane, generally doing an absolutely great job of gaslighting me.
The best part was Seebs’ main issue with me was when I tried to figure out if he was AFAB or AMAB trans - (his being trans already being a tabled concept) - In response he accused me of “outing” him over and over again.
Weeks later, he himself made the argument that it was impossible to out people who had published work under a different name before transition, essentially because they had already outed themselves. (We all can see who’s the hypocrite now.)
(For the record he is AMAB, and considers his relationship to a man to be a gay relationship.)
It’s great to see that he’s already realised people aren’t going to let him get away with talking about transmisandry, but I’d just like to let everyone know how much of an abusive piece of shit he is.
This is a fascinating, but very deceptive, recounting of things.
First off, some history. Here’s the original post about “queer spaces”.. The point here was not that all “safe spaces” should be inclusive of partners, but that at least some should. I wrote that because I know a number of LGBT people who have partners who are straight, and who are sometimes uncomfortable going out to places which ought-to-be-safe, because they might right into hostile people. One person posted in the comments about that asserting that they had, on multiple occasions, thrown drinks on “straight couples” who were making out at gay bars. No evidence that they were straight couples (as opposed to bi couples, or couples with one or more trans people) was ever offered.
That’s where our friend, then called “spinfuse” came in. I don’t recall any “ganging up to say she’s schizophrenic”. I may well have asserted that some of her use of language looked similar to usage I’ve seen in schizoaffective writers before. There’s two posts. The first mention. The second mention. I don’t see any evidence of any “ganging up on”. I mean, seriously, there’s exactly two comments saying it’s sort of similar, and no followup, and I don’t think anyone else even participated in that.
There was nothing at all which could remotely rationally be called “gaslighting”, so far as I could tell.
The interesting part comes from the partially-true but mostly-false claim: “The best part was Seebs’ main issue with me was when I tried to figure out if he was AFAB or AMAB trans - (his being trans already being a tabled concept) - In response he accused me of “outing” him over and over again.”
This claim is materially false, and the one true part is actually pretty shitty itself. Quite simply, it is none of your fucking business whether some random person is AFAB or AMAB. But what spinfuse (apparently now “capitalismskills”) did was not “try to figure out”. It was (1) ask, and (2) make direct unqualified assertions. And what she was accused of was not “outing” me, but trying to. As in, asserting that someone who presents as male and is in a relationship with a gay guy was in fact AFAB. It’s worth noting that, at the time, there were dozens of posts asking for anyone to come forward and say that they thought this behavior was acceptable. Exactly one such post ever materialized, although it was later deleted. It was from one of her other blogs.
In general, though, I stand by the assertion that trying to speculate about people’s birth gender, and bringing it up, is a pretty crappy thing to do, and is inconsistent with the general principles that I normally see trans people advocating. The “for the record” thing is, of course, there just to emphasise her right to talk about my genitals any time she wants, because how I am or am not trans is totally her business. I think it’s also false; I don’t in general think that I consider this a “gay” relationship, or a “straight” relationship, because I just don’t give a fuck about the category. I consider it to be the relationship for which I have a ring. I am not really interested in categories. I definitely do not consider myself “male” in the gender identity sense. (It’s an open question whether I’m agendered or apathetic about being female, and I don’t know how to tell them apart.)
The summary of the later discussion about names is, also, a very inaccurate recounting. Imagine, if you will, that someone is an active member of a community under the name Robert Smith. Books are in print under the name Robert Smith. There’s a Patreon for Robert Smith, the name Robert Smith is on company documentation, there are blog posts on the company blog ascribed to Robert Smith, with the url “/robert”. And then, one day, all of these things are changed to say Julie Smith. So if you go to the blog, and look at the URL, the URL is still “/robert”, but the blog posts all have a byline saying Julie Smith. The Patreon account is the same account, but now says Julie Smith.
Given that, I don’t think it’s particularly meaningful to accuse someone of “outing” Julie by referring to “Robert Smith”, “Julie Smith”, and three or four message board handles, as being the same person. There’s two reasons for which I concluded this.
- Because if you’re putting the new name on a lot of the existing things, you’re pretty much making it clear that these two names are the same person.
- Because there’s no reason for anyone to draw the inference that someone is trans from those two names being in use, because writers use pen names all the time.
Indeed, in that specific case, I did link a couple of people to the company site and ask them questions to which the answer would likely be that person, and they consistently came back with both names and the observation that it appeared that one of them was a pen name. None of them suggested that the person was probably trans.
So I don’t think that giving the information that the person used two names reveals them to be trans in this context, and I also don’t feel that including both names in a list of screen names or aliases reveals anything, when there are multiple sites on which the person has taken the time to take an existing site attached to the old name and change it to use the new name while still displaying the old name as being the same person.
Soooo… Basically, 1/10 for accuracy, 0/10 for ethics, 0/10 for accurate representation of the other side.
heeeeeey, it’s like a roll call of all the self-important assholes who keep cropping up to tell gleefully scandalized lies about my friends so they can feel like mighty warriors of justice.
i’m honored that i got a mention. usually they forget i exist because i don’t bother validating their malignant narcissism by fighting with them.
i think now is a good time to point out, by the way, that i do see your posts when you get up to these silly shenans, and my eyebrows go up a little, and i think, “incoherent. dismissed.” i have no investment in whether you ever realize how full of shit you are. but i am enjoying the thought of you reading this and boiling with rage, furiously trying to find a way to punish me for not taking your nonsensical attacks on people i respect seriously.
but i can.